The doublespeak of Drew Peterson: What does it expose?

DrewPDummieIn the eighteen months since Stacy Peterson disappeared from her home, her husband and only suspect, Drew Peterson has never passed up an opportunity to appear in the media and talk about the case and his life. Drew’s attorney, Joel Brodsky, has allowed and even condoned these many appearances, usually appearing alongside his client.

Brodsky calls this unusual approach his white noise media technique. “Its an over saturation of the media. If you say just a few things they can pick it apart for inconsistencies, but if you say a lot then any inconsistencies will cancel each other out” is how he explained it on an Internet forum.

So, at this point we have many, many statements from Drew Peterson. I don’t know about inconsistencies — he has been pretty consistent with time line details (except for a few glaring exceptions), but all those public statements do seem to have provided more than a few contradictions, or at least discrepancies between what he says and how he acts.

  • Drew seems to have some pretty negative feelings about people wearing wires to gather information, but his own ex wives say that their homes and phones were bugged by him.
  • Drew wants us to believe that he is truthful, and yet he boasts about his days as an undercover narcotics cop and says he enjoyed working “cons”. He also states that back in the day “you had to lie to your girlfriend to see your wife”.
  • Drew denigrates all potential witnesses as drug addicts, street rats, mentally ill, etc. Yet these are the same people that he had work for him, went into business with, and let babysit his kids.
  • Drew takes exception to the Grand Jury of lay people who indicted him for murder because they aren’t legal or forensics experts, but he was happy to accept the decision of the Coroner’s Jury of lay people who said that his third wife’s death was accidental.
  • Drew claims that every potential witness to come forward is just trying to profit from the situation, and yet he’s been charging for interviews as far back as January 2008, and has his PR man pitching reality shows and a book deal.
  • Drew says that his ex-wife Stacy was always “seeking attention from men”, but he never passes up the chance to chat with an attractive reporter or producer, or to go out to bars where girls sit on his lap for photos.

We know there are more than these examples!

Peterson is presently in custody in the Will County Jail, where yesterday he granted a collect-call telephone interview to Matt Lauer of MSNBC. He is scheduled to be arraigned Monday, May 18.

Idea for this post is from a comment by Thinkaboutit. Thanks!

Video of phone interview with Matt Lauer

I don’t know who made the clever book cover at the top, but if it’s yours let me know so I can credit you.

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210 thoughts on “The doublespeak of Drew Peterson: What does it expose?

  1. Moving my last post over ~

    Drew Peterson has used these past eighteen months to sway the jury pool. In fact, I think he even referred to this in a video once as the “jury of his peers.”

    Yet, he says the Grand Jury are lay people who don’t have much going on for themselves when it comes to handing down indictments.

    Let me rephrase that. Drew Peterson doesn’t think the special grand jury hearing testimony in his cases don’t have much going for themselves. Never mentioned anything before this point, so….

    Maybe Peterson is insinuating he might have a hand in picking his jury pool, comprised of lawyers, lawyers and lawyers, heh? That way, they’ll be well versed in the law.

  2. Or, make that sympathetic street rats, lawyers, judges and doctors.

    Yeah, that’s the ticket. That’s who should be on Peterson’s jury. That way, he can’t call them clueless lay people.

    Be careful what you wish for.


    Immediately Following Arraignment on Monday – May 15, 2009

    (PRNewsChannel) / Joliet, Ill. / The following is a media advisory from The Publicity Agency, the PR firm representing Drew Peterson and his legal team:

    Immediately following Drew Peterson’s arraignment at the Will County Courthouse on Monday, May 18th, his legal team led by Joel Brodsky will hold a news conference outside the front entrance to the building. Per request of the Chief Judge’s office, please set-up in courtyard away from sidewalks leading into the building.

    The hearing is currently scheduled for 9:00 AM local time in Courtroom 405.

    Any and all media are encouraged to set-up early with all necessary equipment together, including mic stands, lights, et. al.

    The Publicity Agency founder, Glenn Selig, will be on the ground to handle any media inquiries. Justin Herndon, director of publicity and news at The Publicity Agency, will be available from Tampa.

  4. As if they had to ask the media to come 😉

    Even if the judge lowers the bail, Drew will be arrested again next Thursday LOL

    My husband says the judge will not do it. It would be not ethical to drastically change the decision of the other judge if there are not new issues to do it.
    I hope he is right! 🙂

  5. Thanks for bringing it over, Bucket. You can bet Joel is reading that story this morning!

    Marilyn Brenneman, a senior deputy prosecutor in Seattle’s King County, once won a murder conviction after she showed a jury a video of a news conference given by the man she was prosecuting in a drowning death.

    “We used it to show his attitude was blase,” she said. “He was kind of wooden and didn’t show any emotion. … That is not really an appropriate response.”

  6. Facs said

    Glenn Selig will be “on the ground” as opposed to “in the air”? Heh.
    * * * * * *
    Are we sure he didn’t mean “underground”, the little worm!

  7. Hmmm, sound like anyone you know?

    Sommer was convicted in San Diego in 2007 of first-degree murder in the slaying of her husband after prosecutors based much of their case on the idea that Sommer did not behave like a grieving widow after her husband’s death.

    The jury heard about how Sommer used insurance money to pay for breast implants, took part in wet T-shirt contests and had casual sex with other men.

  8. in today’s age of CSI, Forensic Files, Law & Order, Nancy Grace, GERALDO, etc etc etc…I think the issue for Drew isn’t so much a jury that won’t understand law and evidence…but that maybe they WILL understand more than he wants them to!

    (couldn’t resist adding Geraldo to the mix! 🙂

    to say his jury will be nothing but Lay People who don’t understand these things is another way to deflect…another way for him to set the stage for to say when he is found guilty that they are a bunch of uneducated “street rats”, looking for their 15 minutes of fame or a book burns his biscuits that the jurors will potentially make a buck and retain their freedom when this is all said and done!

    other than Drew’s experience in evidence and witness tampering, exactly how “educated” is he again??? WORST mistake he and his lawyer will make is underestimating the intelligence of a jury, especially since they will have a hand in PICKING it!

    we’ve all said this to Drew before…but tick tock Drew..Tick Tock!

  9. Thanks Think and Facs for the top post. It’s really striking to see them spelled out so. Love it. 🙂

  10. As I understand it, the judge won’t make an immediate decision on the bail hearing. He can take a couple days or week to decide. So, let’s hope DP is rearrested before the decision.

  11. “They’re all trying to make a buck outta me” vs ” If the networks are payin for it, I can’t give away for free.” (paraphrased)

  12. Good one bucket. He’s also trying to get gigs at reality shows, etc to make money. Rumor has it he was selling autographs, but he denied that.

  13. Another piece of Drew logic:

    He claimed LE was psychologically damaging his younger children by allowing Paula to become close while assisting investigation of their mother’s disappearance.
    Yet, there’s apparently no risk at all to moving Chrissy,a woman whom Drew may have known for many years but was likely a near stranger to Stacy’s kids, right in to replace their Mom.

    Then out. Then in. Then out.

  14. For the record, this is what Drew had to say about the GJ to Matt Lauer:

    “Do you have idea what the state’s evidence is against you?” Lauer asked.

    “No idea. And the grand jury system seriously needs to be revised,” he replied. “I truly believe that if they wanted to they could have indicted you for this incident. What you have is a bunch of lay people that are in there and they have been sitting there for 18 months, and they are uneducated on the points of law, rules of evidence and things like that.”

  15. wow! one would think after 18 months they would have learned something??? (I’m being sarcastic)

  16. Every time I read that statement of Peterson’s about the grand jury system, I just can’t believe his lawyer doesn’t find a way to muzzle him.

    But, that’s okay, stupid is as stupid does.

  17. Chrissy’s coworker has weighed in with his take on her statement via Gloria Allred. I’m pasting it here because, frankly some of it is comedy gold and too good to go unseen.

    But please, show some retraint in your responses. He knows her and we do not.

    I like how it is mentioned that they were about to marry. I remember hanging out with Chrissy that March weekend that they were supposed to go to Vegas. She told him to F-Off (Much like she did the media before Allred came to town) and hung around the area. It was just two weeks prior that she was excited about going (wouldn’t tell anyone why) and asking everyone where she can get a passport to go to Nevada.

    It says that she cares for him and hopes that he does to. Wasn’t she engaged to the (alleged) murderer? Shouldn’t that be pretty open-shut? Why is there any doubt in her mind? Maybe she found out what Drew did in Vegas without her.

    Her heart goes out to the families? This is the first time that I have heard this. The ONLY mention of the families from her that I have heard was when she said that looking at the many pictures of Stacey on the wall she felt “creeped-out.” But, I’m sure it was heart-felt.

  18. rescueapet Says:
    May 16, 2009 at 1:23 pm

    Every time I read that statement of Peterson’s about the grand jury system, I just can’t believe his lawyer doesn’t find a way to muzzle him.

    * * * * *

    I’m sure he’s actually quoting Jowl Blobby.

  19. Okay, I should be working, but I cannot help myself from peeking in here.

    Dearheart, I believe the GJ did learn something in 18 months. They learned that he is probably guilty. I say probably since that matter still needs to go to court, innoscent until proven guilty or Drew opens his mouth…..yadda, yadda, yadda.

    Chrissy’s co-worker, now that was a hoot! Thanks for sharing. A passport to Neveda….hahahaha!!

  20. okay..first…LOVE the updated book for Dummies with Drew’s pic..nice touch!

    lol @ at the alleged “co worker” a passport??? to VEGAS??? The Brothel is 30 miles outside of RENO..but okay?????

    they all seem to give new meaning to the saying “stupid is as stupid does” don’t they???

  21. Bucket,

    Good point, maybe they will talk about Kathleen’s letters and things like this. Not sure why they will hold it on May 28th, but only broadcast it in June. I’m sure there will reports after this mock trial.

  22. WSF, Thanks for the reminder. I applied for a ticket…hope I get a seat!

    Dearhheart, Drew and Chrissy had a trip planned for Vegas before the whole reality show situation began. Chrissy decided not to go and Drew went alone.

    If you guys have any questions about the mock trial, Karen Conti has agreed to answer them for us. You need to ask soon though…

  23. “May 28– Chicago attorneys Greg Adamski and Karen Conti, hosts of WGN Radio’s Legally Speaking, will host a mock trial of the closing arguments in the murder prosecution of Drew Peterson for the death of his third wife, Kathleen Savio, from 6-8pm at the IIT Chicago-Kent College of Law.

    The event will be open to the public and taped for broadcast on WGN Radio on Sunday, June 14 and Sunday, June 21. “The People v. Drew Peterson” will feature Greg Adamski as moderator, Karen Conti as prosecutor, and lawyer Joseph R. Lopez as Drew Peterson’s defense attorney. Retired Cook County Circuit Court Judge Richard Neville will preside and a professional jury consultant will be present to quickly screen and select jurors who will be taken from the audience.

    The event is intended as an educational exposition, based solely on the facts that have been publicly reported. Go to for details on how to register for tickets.

    Legally Speaking is an award-winning interactive weekly talk show that airs every Sunday night at 9pm on WGN Radio. Co-hosts and practicing Chicago attorneys Greg Adamski and Karen Conti comment on the legal news in review, interview interesting and timely guests, and answer listeners’ legal questions and concerns.”

  24. Facs, did drew go alone because Chrissy didn’t apply for her passport soon enough? Sorry, couldn’t resist!

  25. Why Aren’t Trials Televised in Illinois?
    Last updated: March 2008

    The following question was submitted to John Roska, an attorney/writer whose weekly newspaper column, “Q&A: The Law,” runs in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch (Illinois Edition) and the Champaign News Gazette.

    Why aren’t trials in Illinois televised? If we can see trials from other states, why not in Illinois, too?

    The simple answer is that Illinois prohibits cameras in the courtroom, at least for trials. The fact that other states do it has not yet persuaded Illinois judges to permit televised trials.

    Illinois Supreme Court Rule 63(A)(7) says that “the taking of photographs in the courtroom during sessions of the court or recesses between proceedings, and the broadcasting or televising of court proceedings is permitted only to the extent authorized by order of the supreme court.”

    Lest that get anyone’s hopes up, the Supreme Court has issued an order that only permits Appellate or Supreme Court cases to be photographed, televised, or broadcast. And then, by only one video or movie camera, one still camera and one audio system, each operated by only one person. Only certain types of cameras are allowed (and most of the permitted still cameras would be considered antiques).

    These restrictions went into effect in 1984, and have not really opened the floodgates to televised coverage of Appellate or Supreme Court proceedings. If anything, the public may have learned from this limited coverage that Appellate Court proceedings lack the excitement of an O.J. Simpson trial. Even with different camera angles, Appellate Court arguments would not attract big audiences.

    Illinois is one of only 12 states that prohibit all trial court proceedings from being televised. Twenty-five states allow trials to be televised with minor restrictions, and 8 others make televised trials more difficult, but not impossible.

    When the Illinois Supreme Court opened the door ever-so-slightly to cameras in the courtroom, its main concern was the disruption from obtrusive and noisy cameras. Technological improvements have pretty much solved that problem, but legitimate concerns remain about how cameras affect the dignity and decorum of the courtroom.

    The U.S. Supreme Court prohibits all cameras in its courtroom, and no live audio coverage. The best they will do is the same-day release of recordings of oral arguments. To sample the oral arguments, click on the link below:

    Oyez – U.S. Supreme Court Media

    Some lower Federal courts experimented with cameras between 1991 and 1994, but have since banned them.

    While the Supreme Court has said that “what transpires in the court room is public property,” it has also said that a media circus can disrupt a trial. For example, they overturned Billy Sol Estes’ fraud conviction because cameras in the courtroom deprived him of a fair trial.

    Before that 1965 decision, cameras in the courtroom were not unusual—even in Illinois. The Loeb-Leopold trial in 1924, for example, was well photographed. Other famous trials with in-court photography were the Scopes “Monkey Trial” and the Lindbergh kidnapping trial

  26. lol @ applying for her passport…ROTFLMAO!!!!

    Why do I feel that she is positioning herself for some sort of fight? her choice of representation reeks of opportunity to cash in, some how, some way.

    or maybe she’s concerned Drew will pin both deaths on her??? hmmm?

    I would be worried if I were her (which I’m not..because I’m NOT THAT STUPID!)

    Gonna go enjoy the rest of the sunshine today and then go out to dinner with family tonight…I hope you all have a wonderful evening!

  27. Drew projects his %$#@ onto anyone he thinks is against him. He spied on and stalked his wives and GF’s and yet,it was he who was fooling around and doing the accusing. When Drew points his finger at someone, he’s pointing 3 right back at his dirty little self. Projection deflects the attention. Too bad some people actually fall for this type of manipulation. It’s important to remain focused on him and not play into this.

  28. Good point, Wow.

    Drew has shown himself over and over to be a master manipulator, to take advantage of the ignorant, the insecure, those who are hungry for affection and structure.

  29. facsmiley Says:

    May 16, 2009 at 5:55 pm
    Good point, Wow.

    Drew has shown himself over and over to be a master manipulator, to take advantage of the ignorant, the insecure, those who are hungry for affection and structure.


    And he knows where to find them !!

  30. Now it’s the Grand Jury’s fault Drew got arrested and they’re a bunch of lay people that don’t have much going for themselves !

    And he says this while he is locked up – LOL, LOL !

  31. MSNBC is showing Lockup: Stateville (Illinois). This is where Drew is likely to end up when he is convicted. It is on now.

  32. “If one wife goes missing and (another) wife is dead, those aren’t usually the subject of jokes,” said Roy Black, a defense attorney whose clients have included Rush Limbaugh and William Kennedy Smith. “People are going to think this is a very bizarre person, who’s more likely to have committed murder than someone who is in mourning.”


    or at least has an issue with who killed his 3rd ex wife or who ran away with his 4th wife, but that doesn’t even interest him.

    It’s all good as far as he’s concerned (!!)

  33. I was looking for any information on Steve Rhea who was said by Rick Mimms and other people to be hung in his garage (???) by Drew in January 1986. I could not find any information on this incident either in old press articles or death records (they are not public info unfortunately) but something attracted my attention.

    There is a Monique L. Rhea living in Chicago who published her book in late Dec. 2007. The book is titled “Why God chose me” and here are some information take on it:

    Why God Chose Me: “Monique L. Rhea’s Journey thru Molestation, Rocky Relationships, Diabetes, Death and Cancer” (Paperback)

    Monique was born in 1973 so she was exactly 15 in 1986. I have not read the book but … it seems to be strange coincidence, isn’t it?

  34. bucketoftea Says:
    May 17, 2009 at 4:49 am

    Cyrhla! Good morning! OMG what have you found???

    Hi, bucket! 🙂
    I couldn’t resist to post the above link.
    Different rings in my brain… like ‘journal of molestation’ from psychics predictions by not found in the backyard… 😉
    I would love to read the book! Much more than the one written by Derek Armstrong. LOL

  35. It seems it would be weirder if it wasn’t her. Sounds like a very interesting book in any case. Brave woman. Clever Cyrhla. 😉

  36. This way he could kill the time in jail instead looking at the mirror walls, right? At least for change. LOL

  37. I don’t think it is her, however. Just a little flicker of synchronicity…. 🙂 Alas, molestation is pretty common.

  38. snipped from cyrhla’s post above;
    Monique was born in 1973 so she was exactly 15 in 1986. I have not read the book but … it seems to be strange coincidence, isn’t it?

    In 1986, she would have been 13. In 1988, she would have been 15.

  39. There is also a porno star of the last name of Rhea living in BB. 37. … but I am not going to advertise her LOL
    Ok, if you think it is not this Monique, just delete my posts. Probably I am apt to think Drew is the only abuser in IL and now all women are safe. LOL

  40. Who is Monique that you are looking for? I must have missed something … will go back and read. LOL ! Don’t delete anything yet!

  41. Okay, I think I get the connection. You are thinking maybe “Monica” is also Monique? As in sister of Steve Rhea.

  42. As a refresher I’ll paste the two pertinent posts from Greta’s here:
    Remember, any association of this to Drew is speculation.

    Larry says:

    December 17, 2007 at 11:50 am

    The man who (supposedly ) hung himself name was Steve Rhea.I was a close friend of his.He died in January of 1986.He lived on nottingham dr. in Bolingbrook…Dp supposedly lived on Mayfield (the next street over).The report I had always heard was that he hung himself in his bedroom closet which ,alway’s sounded a little odd to me.doesn’t sound like a lot of room to hang yourself.The garage sounds like a more likely scenario..He could be hung from a rafter or I-beam…I also know DP used to hang out in that garage with them.I also know that Steve did not approve of DP’s relationship with his sister Monica and, confronted him about it.A short time later…he was found dead….coincidence? Dp was also one of the first officers on the scene…..coincidence?

    shari says:

    December 17, 2007 at 12:58 pm

    I was steve rays best friend. he picked me up from school everyday. rick mims did not hang out with us.He knows nothing about steve. drew would come to steves garage all the time in the evening. he came to hassle us,flirt with us girl,and try to get us to smoke pot with him. I was with steve the night he died. when i left him at four in the morning he was ok.Iwas the closesest person to steve.I know he asked his grandmother for asprin around five.I loved steve with all my heart. It kills me to think he was murdered,if he was. If he killed himself it was something he wanted. If he was murdered by that animal its a horror.Rick MIMS never hung out with us. we all thought he was an idiot ,and would never have let him around. steve died january 2nd, 3rd, or 4th of 86. RICK MIMS was more on DREW PETERSONS level. he was hanging in his bedroom by his boot stings.the room had a false ceiling,he was hanging by a pipe. I pray to GOD the truth will come out. I pray for monicas sake, and his parents, denise,joy, and danny. They will get peace from the truth. TRUST me rick mims never hung out with us. Steve left a note,and anything mims knows he never heard from steve or anyone who hung out with us. Steve and monica were great people. PLEASE GOD let the truth come out.

  43. In Ric Mim’s podcast on that page, Mims says that Drew was married to Vicky at the time he was dating Monica and that he used to bring Monica into their house.

    That sounds like Drew’s style.

  44. Mims said that when he and Drew discussed Rhea’s death, Drew said “Yeah, he was depressed and he had a drug problem”. Mim’s said, “That’s not the Steve we knew!”

    Again, classic Drew style.

    But even Mims said (in November 07)that it looked suspicious but that it could be nothing.

  45. MIMS: Yeah we’ve talked about it because I can’t believe he killed himself and he’s like yeah he had a drug problem and you know and was depressed, and I was like that’s not the Steve we knew. He said I don’t know, I was one of the cops first on the scene and he was hanging in the garage.

    Other reports say he had killed himself in the house, more specifically, his bedroom (closet), (also found “in the basement” which could be where the bedroom was).

  46. Ok, forget about the story and those gossips. About my tip as well 😉

    That was Steven Ray (14) who commited suicide in 1986.

    News article above from CBS2chicago indicates Drew Peterson was fired from Bolingbrook Police Department in 1985 and wasn’t reinstatement with the department until March 1986. If this is true then Peterson wasn’t even employed with the department the beginning of January 1986 when this Steve Ray/Rhea was reported found hanging in his bedroom so it is interesting how Peterson could have been the first officer on the scene as he told Ric Mims he was.

    His sister, Monica, still lives in BB and is 45-46 now, so I guess she was 22/23, and Drew (only LOL) 32 then.

    At least this is clear. And sorry for the confusion. “Rhea” was the name appearing in most of the posts on it.

  47. His name is probably misspelled there too…

    While this stuff is interesting to keep in mind, it’s all old info, and old speculative info at that.

    I’d be happy to see a conviction one of the murders they’ve been collecting evidence on for a year and a half.

  48. As you said, facs, tomorrow is a big day.
    Let’s pray the judge will be more strict than he was with the gun charge.

  49. I wonder if Joel will be baffled when Kelly is not “laughed out of court” for filing a motion to keep the bond high.

    Joel’s been hanging around Drew too long if he thinks that it’s a laughing matter.

  50. How about the fact that he insinuated a first year law student knows more than his opponent in the KS matter does.

    I’ve never heard of an attorney attacking another one personally like that, saying he’ll be laughed out of the courtroom and a first year law student would know better.

    We’ll see I guess. But, if I have my facts straight, Brodsky said Drew would never, never, ever be charged. But they were prepared for this charge. Huh?

  51. Joel is one to talk about a fellow lawyer so poorly. I’d think a first-year law student would know better than to do the following:

    1) Let their client take a polygraph test for a book

    2) Suggest a Date-With-My-Murder-Suspect-Client contest on a radio show

    3) Try to use their client to get advertising for their wife’s bar

    4) Say lie detector tests are not reliable when discussing questions their client failed or to explain why they won’t take it for the authorities but then turn around and tout the questions passed on the lie detector test as proof of their client’s innocence

    5) Go out to bars to party with their client

    6) Not make it to their #1 client’s arraignment and let them sit in jail 10 days but go on a media tour instead

  52. It’s strange to me too, because even when Brodsky has said scathing things about the ISP he has always been very careful to praise Glasgow as an excellent attorney.

    So, maybe now the gloves are off and the insults are on? What’s next — the “C” word?

  53. Yes, everything about how Joel Brodsky tries his case in the public arena is strange.

    Laughable is Brodsky, along with his client, tracking down a woman that was once in a relationship with Tom Morphey, and paying her for pictures that were over ten years old, that are supposed to prove Tom Morphey is a drug user.

    Bring those along to the trial, boob head, and see who gets laughed out of court.

  54. lol…yeah we are talking about someone who has gone as far as handcuffing himself to the table…like an insolent little child…I’m sick of his antics but there’s this part of me wondering just how far he’s gonna go in that court room…I would love it if he’s held in contempt!

    at some point you would think Boobsky would see that he needs to tread lightly..acting like his client isn’t going to do either of them any favors!

  55. LOL – I was thinking about adding that case where Joel chained himself to a table during a court proceeding but I wasn’t sure if it was fact or fiction so I left it off.

    Unfortunately – it will do Brodsky favors. He’s going to make money off of future book deals and the like. So will Drew if he is acquitted.

    This case is going to be talked about for a long time and I’m sure there will be those TV shows where they go over old cases where they cover this case as well.

    Stupid sells, slimy sells, and sinister sells. So I think this wacky duo have the triple crown in those selling points.

  56. Of course, there are those who believe John Carroll was brought on solely for the courtroom part should Drew be tried.

    I realize Joel stated months ago that he, himself, would be lead attorney, but who knows what they are thinking now…

  57. Brodsky told King he believes the case has always been about circumstantial evidence and that he will bring a pathologist to trial who will say Savio died from an accidental drowning.

    This is one example of the disbelief I have in sticking to this accidental drowning theory.

    If Kathleen somehow stumbled, bounced off the walls doing it, bruised herself all up in the process, ankles included, gashed her head, and fell into the bathtub to drown in water that then drained out, where were the clothes she was wearing at the time of this phenomenon? As I understand it, she was naked in the tub, dead. There were no discarded clothes found in the bathroom. Why was she naked, then? Taking that a step further, if she took her clothes off to begin getting ready to take her bath in the filled tub of water, then where were the dry pieces of clothing she was going to wear after getting out of the tub, and dry towel/s she needed.

    No matter how Brodsky’s expert pathologist testifies as to how he believes she beat herself to a pulp flying around the room after tripping and falling, how is one to get past the idea that no prior preparation was made for this bath? If she landed in the tub after this enormous amount of bounce-off activity she suffered from gashing her head and falling into the tub, how does one get past the lack of preparation for the bath?

  58. Devil’s advocate would say that Kathleen enjoyed walking nude through her house and that her discarded clothes and fresh clothes would be in her bedroom. But I never heard of that being the case either.

    Wasn’t her bedroom orderly, except for papers strewn on the bed?

    Of course, I guess she could have worn a robe into the bathroom. Was there a robe hung up in there?

    Even in the event that the defense can convince the jury that the absence of clothing was not unusual, what about her long hair being down, her long nails being trimmed short, and the fact that she was wearing her jewelry?

    Oh, and the many bruises on her body…and the gash on her head…and the empty tub…and the dried blood in the tub…and the documented incidents of abuse…the fact that she told her sisters that Drew was going to kill her and make it look like an accident…that he admits he broke into her house on at least one occasion to remove items…the fact that the next wife told someone that she knew Drew killed Kathleen…and the suspicious will executed by Drew’s uncle…the bifurcated divorce…the fact that Drew removed almost all of Kathleens’ posessions out of the house before her estate was settled..and the subsequent disappearance of his next wife who wanted out of the marriage and was ready to talk about how Kathleen died…

  59. It’s been a long time since we’ve gone over all of the minute details about Kathleen’s mysterious death.

    Anyone recall, offhand, the approximate day/time it was determined that she died from this mysterious bath tub incident?

  60. Whether the lack of clothes, dirty or clean, can be explained away or not, there is no disputing, from what’s been reported so far, that she made any personal preparation for this bath, other than having a tub full of water, and being naked. The gash on her head, we’re to believe, was such that it caused her to be unable to crawl to a phone or help herself in any way. I am not clear on where we’re to believe she received this gash, other than remembering something insane like cracking the back of her head on the faucet, but then falling forward into the tub.

    In fact, the theory of all of this is so bizarre, I have a hard time keeping it all straight and putting it into any logical order.

  61. As I recall, the autopsy report was signed w/ the wrong date, so who knows how accurate it is.

  62. as I recall Drew explained those bruises on her body already…remember? He stated that she and the boys wrestled all the time…so he basically laid blame on the children for those wounds

  63. I hope Judge Schoenstedt is on the right side though IMO he has been too tolerant for Drew as for returning Drew’s seized things and gun charges. I hope he is not going to reduce the bail more than by half. I have read about his other decisions and have mixed feelings.

    Some info on the bails set by Judge Schoenstedt, just to let Brodsky down a little bit he thinks 500.000 is maximum.

    – A man accused of the “Nightcrawler” sex attacks (3 mln bail)

    – Two young men accused of murdering a gas station clerk charged with armed robbery and three counts of murder in the shooting death of Raman Patel, 50. One of them eligible for the death penalty. (bail = 10 mln per each)

    – A man accused of shooting his wife to death /shot his wife. He suspected her of having an affair, and she was talking on the telephone at the time, police said. He is being held at the Will County Jail, and bail was set at $10 million.

    Besides all the issues Brodsky recalled to justify the decrease of the bail, there are also the children. And I am sure Brodsky&Co are going to use this argument.

    I cannot imagine Drew coming back home…and trying to stay optimistic. 🙂

  64. very good post by Susan…this turn the head sweep under the rug mentality by the boys in blue is something that happens many times

    where I am our Chief of Police was once accused of date rape..he admitted it to two of his co workers that went and spoke with the victim convincing her not to file formal charges because there was “no chance she’d win with his record and families connection to law enforcement” etc eventually he became the Chief…he had married and had two kids…his wife left him…she filed for divorce in a different county to keep it from being picked up by the media because she feared what he could do..yes he threatened to kill her if she ever left him..he continued to threaten her and use his friends to harass and manipulate and intimidate her…she believed in order to get her divorce she could do so in another county to keep it from hitting the news…an internet “blogger” who has a beef with the Tacoma Police Department somehow caught wind of the marital strife and dug up the divorce records which requested an order of protection based on the abuse history…he then turned it all over to the media and all hell broke loose…the Chief found her in a strip mall parking lot near her home with her children…he put a bullet in her head and then shot himself..he died at the scene, she lingered for over a week…the children witnessed the entire event, I believe all of this could have been prevented and that she may have never given him the time of day if his “fellow officers” had upheld the law to begin with and filed the rape report..but they turned a blind eye, they helped out their “brother” a man that would eventually kill the mother of his children and himself.

    it’s sickening

    her parents have a blogspot called

    they also started a foundation called The Chrystal Judson Family Justice Center that helps those in domestic abusive relationship escape safely their website is

    I really admire Susan Murphy Milano for her dedication to truth and justice and for victims…there are far too many examples of how the “thin blue line” gets crossed time and time again and no one does anything about it..I think officers that commit these acts should be punished MORE severely than the average citizen considering they have sworn to uphold the law and instead used their position within it to live by their own set of laws..hopefully with enough energy and attention brought to this issue, a change will come for the better

  65. Folks, can we please stay on topic and/or keep our comments on point.

    While we all have opinions on abuse and abusers, let’s not take to task any particular segment of the population as being more prone to this wide-spread problem.

    Thank you.

  66. When the time comes, let’s just hope Joel gets to play the video in Court of young Thomas’s alibi for his Dad.

    The Jury will then be able to see for themselves what a responsive Dad Drew is and the loving and close relationship he has with his two sons (!!)

  67. I wonder…Does anyone here happen to know what we can expect from the Prelim tomorrow other than the bail issue ?? TIA

  68. I think they’ll just have Thomas testify. It’s too bad though because that video speaks volumes. IMO

  69. Re Kathleen and the bath tub,

    She would have had to have a bath between 2am and 6 am and do a few somersaults or flying leaps to end up the way she did.

    A pretty normal thing to do at that time of the night !

  70. oh justanotherhen…don’tcha know I do that all the time!

    how many of you fill the tub completely before entering it? do you get in while it’s filling or wait until it’s completely full?

  71. if the answer is the majority enter the tub while it’s still filling..and that is what Kathleen did..then the water should have still be running when she was found if we are to believe she fell while getting into the tub

    if the argument is she fell while getting out of the tub..where was the evidence that a bath took place? soap/bubble/oil residue in the tub..dried suds on the sides etc…was there a washcloth or a scrubby? was it wet? was there soap? was it wet? I wouldn’t imagine that even with the tub slowly draining that the cloth/soap/mitt etc wouldn’t still be a little damp given that time frame

  72. according to the estimated time of death..she would have had to have had a bath very late at night very early in the morning

  73. noway406 Says:

    May 17, 2009 at 6:18 pm
    JAH, why do you say “She would have had to have a bath between 2am and 6 am”?


    because that is the estimated time of death, noway

  74. From Twitter:

    PublicAgency Arraignment for Drew Peterson 5-18-09 9 A.M. Room 405 Pubicagency will be on the ground (maybe licking Joel Brodsky’s shoes clean?) #Drew

    about 5 hours ago from web


  75. Earliest time of death was Sunday morning, February 29. (see #14 p. 4/15)

    During early morning hours of March 1, Stacy observed Drew washing clothes and he said he’d hit Kathleen in back of head. (see bulleted items beginning p. 6/15)

    Is there some document that you’re looking at that has a more specific date/time of death?

  76. facsmiley Says:

    May 17, 2009 at 6:40 pm
    From Twitter:

    PublicAgency Arraignment for Drew Peterson 5-18-09 9 A.M. Room 405 Pubicagency will be on the ground (maybe licking Joel Brodsky’s shoes clean?) #Drew

    about 5 hours ago from web



    They better be careful as if they’re on the ground they may get trampled (!!)

  77. I’m not thinking she took a bath on her own, just trying to figure out when Drew could have been there (how late on Monday).

    I wish I had a more detailed timeline of his activities on Sunday and Monday.

    She could have been preparing to taking a bath on Sunday evening when Drew surprised her/killed her. He could have come back later to set the stage. I think anyway.

  78. Out to get donuts in the morning and a trip to the aquariaum in the afternoon.

    Did I also read that he stopped by work for some reason, or am I completely making that up?

    Oh and Stacy had her wisdom teeth out so Drew as ‘babysitting’ her all weekend.

  79. Of course we have this but consider the source:

    Drew’s timeline for last weekend of February (As published in Drew Peterson Exposed)

    Feb. 27 – Drew picks up Tom and Kris from Savio’s home. He spends the rest of the night at home with Stacy and his children.

    Feb. 28 – Drew spends the day at home with his family, including his adult son Stephen.

    Feb. 29 – Drew, Stacy and the children go to the Shedd Aquarium before attempting to return Tom and Kris at about 8 p.m. Savio does not answer the door or her phone.

    March 1 – Drew calls and leaves messages for Savio throughout the day but does not get a response. He goes to work at 5 p.m. and goes to Savio’s house at 7 p.m. He summons Savio’s neighbors, Mary Ponterelli and Steve Carcerano, and a locksmith to gain entry to Savio’s home. Ponterelli and Carcerano enter the home while Peterson waits outside. Peterson runs into the house when he hears the neighbors scream.

    Is Stephen going to be his new alibi since Stacy is “missing”?

  80. I saw Drew Peterson on a recent interview somewhere say something to the effect that they did a test on the drain in the bath tub and it actually had a small leak, which is why the water leaked out of the tub.

    Okay. He said that. But, I am curious about whether that actually was mentioned in any of the prior information made public, or if that was even done.

  81. I just wanted to make an observation about the perp walk into the jailhouse (look at this bling. My God!)

    The way he said ‘My God’ at the end of that statement really sounds to me like he was shrieking with elation. Yes, elation. He sounded positively drunk with excitement. I truly believe he is way more narcissistic and sociopathic than we all realise.

    I reckon that’s why the GJ has taken so long. There is SO much to get your head around. I think the dirty deeds go way deeper than anybody could have imagined.

  82. I thought that that Sunday he tried to return the kids and tried contacting Kathleen and spoke with the neighbor who according to him wanted to enter the house SUNDAY night but he decided to wait until the following day, but instead of going over during the day time, he went to work instead and about two hours after starting his shift is when he went and got the neighbor and Steve C. and the locksmith

    I always found that to be odd..and I do wonder on Monday during the day if he did go into work why he didn’t request a welfare check then..or if he attempted to contact her through out the day before going to work?

    I already know he never contacted anyone else but the neighbor as to her possible whereabouts or his “concern” for her

    I know I read somewhere that he went into work briefly that Sunday..let me see if I can find it..maybe I’m cofusing it with his actual shift on Monday?

  83. I didn’t read it in a time line anywhere, it was in a Medical report and it said the time of death was between 2 am and 6 am.

  84. I guess I should have taken that further and said that I find it unusual that anyone even bothered testing that tub for a leak, when they didn’t bother to declare the scene anything other than an accident.

    As to his “alibi,” I am one to believe that Steve is the one they’re talking about when saying his son is going to provide an air-tight alibi for him during the time he would have been in the house killing her. I cannot believe they’re relying on an (at the time) eleven year old providing a time line during those crucial hours of her death.

    In addition to him saying he spent the day with his kids, including Steve, that would also have included, I assume, Steve’s girlfriend at the time, Jennifer. We do know she was called before the GJ, and she was seen in the presence of a defense lawyer to boot.

  85. March 1 – Drew calls and leaves messages for Savio throughout the day but does not get a response. He goes to work at 5 p.m. and goes to Savio’s house at 7 p.m. He summons Savio’s neighbors, Mary Ponterelli and Steve Carcerano, and a locksmith to gain entry to Savio’s home. Ponterelli and Carcerano enter the home while Peterson waits outside. Peterson runs into the house when he hears the neighbors scream.

    wait a minute wait a minute!!!!!

    he went to work at 5 pm…then went to the house at 7pm and they didn’t get in until after 9 pm??? that makes no sense at all if a locksmith was called, it does not take a locksmith that long to get into a home, and did she or did she not have an alarm??? would they not contact the alarm company informing them that they are doing a welfare check so if the alarm goes off they can contact said police officer or department?

    this quote is Drew’s version of the time line…how will he explain a two hour discrepancy..especially since Steve C states that it was “around 9 pm” when Drew flagged him down to come to the house, did Drew flag him down, or was this an arranged time, or Drew decided to have his buddy involved in this discovery for good measure???

    his time line has been disputed by his friend and the neighbor

  86. All I could find in the original coroner’s report was March 1/11:17 pm which was just when she was found and the EMTs declared date and time of death.

    It could be in Baden’s autopsy. I don’t think Blum’s was released to the public.

    I believe Drew also said the kids did not like taking baths in that tub because the water drained out. It was something like 3 hours and I wondered what 9 and 11 year old would take a 3-hour bath.

  87. I just went and read SMM blog and am quite disturbed that the Kathleen Savio case has taught the officers of Will County nothing! It’s an absolute disgrace and I find it quite scary:

    “Those married to abusers in law enforcement face the same obstacles as my own mother twenty years ago. Not much has changed as I recently learned while in Will County assisting 2 police officers wive’s whose life mirror’s that of Kathleen Savio. Police refusing to take a police report against their officer abuser’s or taking her to the hospital for medical attention as the blood drips down her face. Employee’s within the Will County State’s Attorney’s office being fed fear if they contact me on a case directly or refer officers wives in my direction.”

  88. and lets just say that it took that long before a locksmith could get there, couldn’t he call in another officer to enter the home by breaking in if the concern was he didn’t want Kathleen freaking out about him being the one to do it???

    I happen to know there is a protocol that has to be followed when gaining access for a welfare check, especially within the department, did Drew follow this protocol? Did he ever inform his superiors of his plans to conduct this welfare check?

    I would love to hear from this “locksmith” as to when he was called, what he was told, if it was on behalf of Drew as a citizen or as an officer, and exactly what he himself may have witnessed that night

  89. I think the whole bath scene was the actual staging with the deliberate intend to have her found naked and bloated, the ultimate humiliation (!)

  90. never mind the obvious lack of seeking her out prior to all of this, I don’t know about any of you, but if I’m not home my ex contacts my mother, if my mom has no clue where I am, he contacts my friends and other family members, he gets a hold of my boyfriend, if no one knows where I am and he begins to worry, he would check the hospitals and the jails..then he would take the steps of calling an officer or trying to gain access to my home

    and we get along with each other!

    the act of the welfare check alone was extremely suspect of him, especially given their history with each other, that in of itself should have been enough for them to look closer at her death…why did they all seem to turn such a blind eye to it???

  91. He had to be the first officer on the scene, that’s why it was played that way (the locksmith bs, etc)

  92. facsmiley Says:
    May 17, 2009 at 7:10 pm

    “TIME OF DEATH: 11:17 P.M.
    TIME OF AUTOPSY: 2:20 P.M.”

    From the coroner’s report.

    I just read that the date of autopsy was March 2, 15 hours after her reported TOD.

    Yes, I’m also looking forward to hear what the locksmith has to say.

  93. Interesting post on a forensics blog about the case:

    The first issue that this case brings up is the time of death. This can be crucial in any case since witness statements and alibis sink or swim based upon the time of death. Since Kathleen’s body was not found until the next day many hours had passed after her untimely death and such a time lag can make determining an accurate time of death very difficult. There is a bit of controversy around exactly where Drew Peterson was at various times on the day and evening prior to Kathleen’s body being found, so the time of death is somewhat muddy here and could play an important role in the upcoming trial.

  94. BADEN: Well, from the beginning we’re talking about from the rigor mortis and the lividity that was present when Kathleen was found in the tub about 11:00 PM would indicate that she died sometime between, say, 2:00 and 6:00 AM Monday morning, I think just the time that Mark has found out that Drew doesn’t really have an alibi. Whatever it is, whoever did it, was done — she died around 4:00 AM, plus or minus two hours, on Sunday morning.,2933,317115,00.html

  95. facsmiley Says:

    May 17, 2009 at 7:10 pm
    “TIME OF DEATH: 11:17 P.M.
    TIME OF AUTOPSY: 2:20 P.M.”

    From the coroner’s report.


    That was the time she was declared dead at the scene.

    That’s not the time frame in which she actually died.

    That’s only established during the autopsy.

  96. “…she died around 4:00 AM, plus or minus two hours, on Sunday morning.”

    So, according to Baden between 2:00 am and 6:00 am Sunday morning.

  97. I hadn’t realized that Baden had pinpointed the time of death to 4 a.m., plus/minus 2 hours. Thank you JAH for getting me wondering!

    Now when I say I want detailed timeline info, I mean hour-to-hour. Not what Drew provided. 🙄

  98. she died around 4:00 AM, plus or minus two hours, on Sunday morning


    and that’s when young Thomas said their Dad was with them the whole time and Abood said that is the airtight alibi !

  99. I wonder whether Larry Blum agreed with that estimated TOD and what expert Brodsky will get. And what that expert will have to say.

  100. That means that Thomas was up all night with his Dad.

    But Drew has said he was in bed with Stacy !

    hmmmm, how does that work ??

  101. The only new bit of info I got from the report is that the home of Kathleen’s boyfriend, Steve, was robbed and Kathleen withdrew $9000 from the bank (apparently to give to him) the day before she died.

    has this been confirmed? because I don’t know about the banks there, that would mean she withdrew this money on a SUNDAY? she wasn’t found until Monday, if she withdrew this money on Saturday how did she give it to her boyfriend if he was out of town? did she western union these funds etc

    are they sure SHE withdrew it and not Drew?

    if this is true, what happened to that money? hmmm?

  102. Interesting bit from Baden’s interview with Greta:

    ..we can find things that can be helpful. For example, we’ll find out things about time of death that the police can then use to determine, if various people have alibis for that time, if those alibis are valid. And one of the things that comes out of the observations back when the body was found is that her degree of settling of blood, lividity, her degree of rigor mortis, would indicate that she was dead for a good 36 hours.,2933,331869,00.html

  103. Thomas was 11 years old at the time of her death…I suppose Drew has TOLD him how everything happened and has insisted that he doesn’t remember certain factoids of the situation

    my parents could have told me I had a pet giraffe growing up, I may not remember ever feeding the animal or riding it to school but by golly if they told me I had one..I’m going to start believing that I did!

  104. DH – I believe the money was withdrawn on Saturday. This was reportedly in the documents that were taken from the ISP car and given to Fox. Fox has not released them in their entirety.

    It was probably confirmed by speaking to Steve Maniaci and looking at his own statements. I’m sure if that is the info the ISP had, it was from some source and was not just made up.

  105. okay so do we go with the time she was found or the time listed on the first autopsy? she was found after 9 pm on March 1st..the autopsy lists the time as 11:17 pm on March 1st which is the time the paramedics processed her

    so 36 hours prior??? makes that ugggh I hate math…11 pm the night before is minus 24 hours..leaving 12 hours from 11 pm on Sunday would make her estimated time of death at…11 am on Saturday morning

    is that correct? am I figuring this out right?

  106. snipped: … when the body was found is that her degree of settling of blood, lividity, her degree of rigor mortis, would indicate that she was dead for a good 36 hours.

    Now I’m confused. He says she died Sunday between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m., yet “a good 36 hours” puts you at Sunday at 11 a.m.

    Is that the latest she could have died? Then what is the 4 a.m. plus/minus 2 hours?

    Someone save me.

  107. LOL, Dearheart, if you are wrong, I am wrong. We came up with the same thing.

    Re: The bank withdrawal. That amount of cash would require a teller withdrawal, not ATM. At least at my bank, which has a limit of how much you can withdraw using ATM.

  108. Dearheart I had Monday 11:17 – 24 = Sunday 11:17 -12 more hours makes it 11 a.m. on Sunday. Still not the 2 a.m. to 6 a.m. that he also stated.

    Still confused.

  109. no wait..11 am Sunday morning??? oops! not Saturday

    I know that lividity alone is not enough to estimate the time of death…they need rigor and possibly even liver temperature to get it between a time to time

    also taken into account would be environmental factors..for example if someone is found out in freezing temperatures it can delay TOD because it can delay rigor/liver mortis etc

    wonder if being submerged in water for any amount of time can delay this process?

  110. wow Kathleen gives her boyfriend $9000..that would have burned Drew’s biscuits!

    where did Kathleen get that kind of money, I know in the separation she was struggling..she listed out tax debts etc in her letter to the state’s attorneys office…was there an equity line of credit on the house she could access without Drew’s permission or signature???

    I wonder if he had her house bugged? had gps on her or friends reporting back to him about her dealings during this time?

  111. “her degree of rigor mortis, would indicate that she was dead for a good 36 hours.”

    I read this to mean that it was “at least 36 hours”

  112. Dearheart, I think we’ll have to wait for trial.

    Facs’ post is from Friday, February 22, 2008 (February 21 air date); the( link to the one I posted is Monday, December 17, 2007 (December 14 air date).

    Not sure what that means except that it is from two different interviews.

  113. dearheart88 Says:

    May 17, 2009 at 7:11 pm
    March 1 – Drew calls and leaves messages for Savio throughout the day but does not get a response.

    Reminds me of when he left TM with Stacy’s phone with strict orders not to answer it. I say he knew Kathleen wouldn’t be able to answer.

  114. I think you’re right Noway…we’re going to have to wait for the actual report at trial

    I’m confused now..involve math in the mix and I get lost and lost fast! lol

    I do however know and have always known you do NOT need a passport to go to Vegas! so there! 😀

  115. tink1 Says:
    May 17, 2009 at 8:18 pm

    dearheart88 Says:

    May 17, 2009 at 7:11 pm
    March 1 – Drew calls and leaves messages for Savio throughout the day but does not get a response.

    Reminds me of when he left TM with Stacy’s phone with strict orders not to answer it. I say he knew Kathleen wouldn’t be able to answer.


    yes I agree with this..but what bugs me is never contacting her family or other friends to attempt to locate her..he had no problem calling her sister the night of her death to tell her Kathleen was dead..a person is off the radar for a couple of days and you never call family? but he had the number..he called Anna and told her Kitty was dead!

    on what authority did he have to be the one to make that call…that’s the lead officers job along with the coroners office…master manipulator Drew..always has to be in control

  116. that was the 3rd autopsy

    which TOD would be impossible to determine after that many years..the TOD is based on the original autopsy report, witness accounts, example..last time she was seen or spoken to etc

    Dr. Baden agreed with the estimated TOD cited from the first autopsy.

  117. I never saw a TOD cited from the first autopsy. LOL … I feel like I’ve going in circles.

    Hope to be back online tomorrow around 9 Central.

  118. a person is off the radar for a couple of days and you never call family?


    especially if there are children that need to go back.

    besides what about not just Drew not calling but what about Kathleen herself ??

    didn’t Drew say he “wasn’t sure he had an extra day” ??

    if it was such a vague arrangement he didn’t know he had this “extra day”, wouldn’t Kathleen have rung HIM if the “extra day” was news to her too ??????

    no calls from Kathleen to Drew – uh, uh !!

  119. Ugh, I hate reading this stuff, let alone posting it.

    Drew Peterson’s Legal Counsel to Appear on Major Network Morning Shows

    Joel Brodsky, lead defense counsel, and Reem Odeh will be interviewed in advance of Drew Peterson’s arraignment Monday morning. – May 17, 2009

    (PRNewsChannel) / Joliet, Ill. / The following is a media advisory from The Publicity Agency, the public relations firm representing Drew Peterson and his legal team:

    Joel Brodsky and Reem Odeh will be interviewed by all three network morning shows from the Will County Courthouse in Joliet, Ill. prior to the arraignment hearing for their client, Drew Peterson.

    They will appear on NBC’s Today Show, ABC’s Good Morning America and CBS’ The Early Show.

    A news conference is planned outside the front entrance to the courthouse immediately following the arraignment of Drew Peterson. Per request of the Chief Judge’s office, please set-up in courtyard away from sidewalks leading into the building.

  120. Oke to go back to the topic of Drew double speak, how about this one.

    Early in the day of his arrest Drew says to reporters hanging around his house:

    “There is nothing to see here, nothing is going to happen, you can go home now as there is not going to be an arrest today”

    After his arrest:

    ” With reporters hanging around I knew something was up, so I wanted to go to the bank to get some money out for my family, but they blockeded me just up the road”

    How about some Joel Brodsky double speak:

    “There are no overhears, it is just Paula and Lenny wanting to make money for themselves”.

    After the overhears were confirmed by the Judge and said to be “very extensive”

    “I knew Drew was being taped as early as June, I was suspicious of Lenny and Paula straight after the gun transfer”

    LOL,LOL Joel Brodsky admits he knew his client was being taped and just let him hang himself for a few more months !!

  121. Maybe I do get it.

    Famous words from Reem Odeh, “He says the case is going to make us famous and we’re all going to get book deals”

  122. Second favorite Reem Odeh quote:

    “”I’m concerned that there’s more emphasis and more of an effort to cater to the media frenzy than there is to looking into the issues surrounding the investigations,” Odeh said. “It just seems to me that when there’s nothing going on with the investigation and things are quiet in the media, it seems like sometimes either Joel or Drew says something to start the media frenzy all over again.””

  123. PETERSON: …I’d really like to clear that up. The state police came in when they did their initial investigation and they did a drain test on the bathtub and they filled it up with water and it took two hours for the thing to drain and the kids—my boys—were even talking about taking a bath. They couldn’t take a bath for very long because the drain was broken in it.

    Question: If it was so unsatisfying to try to take a bath in that tub, why was Kathleen doing it?

  124. I just became aware of one added beneift of having Drew behind bars. I haven’t felt as if I had to listen to Mancow for a week.

  125. Good luck with the “evil one”.

    Let’s hope there is no leniency re the children “needing him” considering the charges are for him to have murdered their MOTHER !!

  126. Besides they’ve been told he’s “helping the Police”, so they’ll understand if he needs to help the Police a bit longer – LOL !!

  127. Good morning, everyone. 🙂

    I have just finished your discusion from yestarday/today and wanted to add something on rigor mortis.
    Temperature is an important factor in determining the time of onset of rigor. In normal circumstances and at room temperature rigor is complete in about three to six hours. If the temperature is higher the onset is more rapid — perhaps no more than an hour in tropical temperatures. Conversely, the onset of rigor is delayed at low temperatures. In cases of drowning in cold water, for example, rigor may not appear until the body has been removed from the water, even after several days of immersion. The onset of rigor is hastened if there has been intense physical activity shortly before death. Thus, in forensic medical practice, the presence of rigor is a poor determinant of the time of death. Once established, the duration of rigor ranges from 18 to 36 hours.

    I just wonder how Kathleen’s hair could have been still wet at 11 pm if she had been killed between 2 and 6 am. I think Drew was on the scene again before calling Potarelli and Carcerano in.
    The additional info with Kathleen looking like a baloon is really confusing there as well because this kind of decomposition takes place 48-72 hours after death.
    IMO, Drew killed Kathleen on Suday when he left for doughnut and spend the rest of that day with the family to have alibi; then in the early morning he went to KS’s house to make order and was there again shortly before calling the locksmith (if any, because there was not force entry reported to the house!).

  128. I keep my fingers crossed Drew has his bail reduced max. by half and Judge Schoenstedt to be less tolerant for this POS.

  129. snipped
    The state police … did a drain test on the bathtub and they filled it up with water and it took two hours for the thing to drain … They couldn’t take a bath for very long because the drain was broken in it.

    This is what I was talking about (incorrectly thought it was 3 hours though).

    If the tub, when filled. took 2 hours to drain, isn’t that long enough for someone (especially an 9 year old or 11 year old boy) to take a bath?

    If it were filled at half that level, is it safe to assume it would take approximately 1 hour to drain?

    Again, I’d say that was plenty of time for anyone to take a bath.

    Am I missing something there? What was Drew’s point?

  130. Morning, Cyrhla!

    It is all confusing about the time of death etc. Perhaps deliberately so. I look forward to that all being thrashed out in court. 🙂 As for bail, I’m interested to see exactly how that is argued, too.

    Is Chrissy going to attend today to support Drew? I think there is going to be a Savio contingent present.(yay)
    I’m not surprised Reem is involved now. They’re rolling her in (because she’s female) to talk about the kids, I bet.

  131. There probably was no point noway, Drew just likes to waffle about whatever makes him look credible and besides how do we know the State Police did this or that if that is what DREW claims (!)

  132. Can anyone direct me to the article in which Steve Carcerano admits that he was the locksmith that opened Kathleen’s door?

    I don’t recall this happening, but was told it had (on another board) and am trying to find out exactly what Steve C. said.

    Does anyone know what I’m talking about?

  133. I just wonder how Kathleen’s hair could have been still wet at 11 pm if she had been killed between 2 and 6 am.


    Hello cyrhla,

    We don’t know how wet Kathleens hair was, maybe it just looked wet opposed to really being wet.

    Also because she was deceased there would have been no body heat or heat from her scalp to facilitate her hair to dry, so maybe it can stay damp or whatever for much longer ??

  134. Didn’t Drew say that he and the locksmith stayed outside and he (Drew) went in when he heard the screams?

    Drew also said that Mary and Steve went in the house, so if Steve was the locksmith, how could he have gone in the house as Steve and stayed outside with Drew as the locksmith?

    Going to try to get some sleep now.

  135. dunno about Christina, but if I am thinking what I’m thinking is correct, she may become Drews worst nightmare yet in all of this !!


    I don’t think this from Time magazine has already been posted, but please delete if it has, Gatekeep 🙂
    I thought this was a very clear and interesting explanation of the hearsay issues:


    For years, courts have allowed certain types of hearsay testimony. However, matters became complicated in 2004, when the U.S. Supreme Court issued a ruling in Crawford v. Washington, a case involving a husband, Michael Crawford, convicted of stabbing a man he claimed tried to rape his wife, Sylvia. After having initially complained about her husband’s actions, the wife declined to testify, citing marital privilege. The central issue was the admissibility of the wife’s statements to police officers just after the incident. Could it be considered evidence or was it hearsay? In the majority opinion, which reversed Crawford’s conviction for assault and attempted murder, Justice Antonin Scalia wrote that allowing the statement as testimony violated the husband’s Sixth Amendment right “to be confronted with the witnesses against him” — in other words, to cross-examine the witness.

    Then, in the case of Giles v.California last year, the Supreme Court ruled that statements to law enforcement officers are admissible as testimony if the defendant is found to have caused “unavailability.” In that case, Dwayne Giles was convicted of fatally shooting his ex-girlfriend, Brenda Avie. He claimed to have acted in response to threats on his life. California courts allowed as testimony Avie’s previous statement to police that he had, in fact, threatened her. A provision of the state law allows out-of-court statements to be admitted if the declarant is unavailable (or, in this case, dead) at the time of the trial. The Supreme Court’s ruling essentially confirmed the legal concept known as “forfeiture by wrongdoing.”

    Last fall came Illinois’s new hearsay law — coincidentally, one of the last pieces of legislation signed by Rod Blagojevich before he left office in disgrace. The law seems to resemble the increasing number of statutes across the country essentially codifying the Giles decision. “A statement is not rendered inadmissible by the hearsay rule if it is offered against a party that has killed the declarant … intending to procure the unavailability of the declarant as a witness in a criminal proceeding,” the law states.

    Those two Supreme Court cases, along with Illinois’s law, may give Will County prosecutors key openings in their quest to invoke some of Savio’s statements. To succeed on that front, prosecutors must first focus on aspects of the Giles ruling that give particular consideration to statements from victims of abusive relationships, including those ending in murder. So in pre-trial hearings, prosecutors must quickly examine Savio’s frame of mind when she crafted her statements. Among the questions they will likely explore: How fearful was Savio for her life, and that her children would be taken away? Did she intend the letter to someday be used as courtroom evidence? Prosecutors will also raise the isolation factor: Savio was probably, for a time, intimidated by the likelihood that her allegations would at least initially be investigated by her estranged husband’s fellow Bolingbrook police officers. “With all of those little facts added together, the judge would have to decide whether the reason he kills her is to keep her from testifying by a preponderance of evidence,” says David A. Erickson, director of the criminal-litigation program at Chicago-Kent College of Law and a former appellate court judge.

    But isn’t asking a judge to consider and then admit such statements into a trial essentially asking him or her to cast the defendant as guilty before the case even reaches a jury? Supreme Court Justices David Souter and Ruth Bader Ginsburg raised this issue in response to the majority opinion in Giles (also authored by Scalia). They wrote, “Equity demands something more than this near circularity before the right to confrontation is forfeited, and more is supplied by showing intent to prevent the witness from testifying.”

    Meanwhile, experts say it will be far trickier for prosecutors to admit Stacy Peterson’s apparent statement to her pastor mainly because he was not a law enforcement officer — and the Supreme Court rulings dealt only with statements offered to police.

    Will County’s Glasgow calls the new law a “significant step forward in the prosecution of these types of cases” but concedes, “We’ve got a tough road ahead of us.” Prosecutors say they have ample evidence beyond the statements to support their case. For now, Peterson remains in a Will County jail on $20 million bond. If he is found guilty, he could face a 60-year sentence. Precisely when Peterson’s trial will open is unclear.

    In the meantime, there is the case of his missing fourth wife. The Will County grand jury has two scheduled meetings left to decide on charges. Even if the panel fails to come to a resolution, prosecutors are expected to continue their investigation. So, in some ways, this may all be a simple prelude to an even greater Drew Peterson spectacle.

  137. I do know, noway, but I read the information there was not forced entry to the house. IMO, and I may be wrong, if there had been a locksmith there, it would be called ‘forced’, right?

    I hope Chrissy is not going to be there. If she is, I think it will explain a lot as for Allred’s role in the case.

    As for Reem, bucket, she had more important things to do than just mess aroung with Brodsky ;). A cetain basic military rule says, do not disrespect your enemy. Brodsky, IMO, is just a figure and there are lots of smart and educated people behind him who just do not want to devastate their careers as Brodsky does (or I should rather say he has nothing to devastate 😉 ).
    I am speculating now, but I think Brodsky had known Drew was going to be arrested and the amount of the bail. The whole staff with him going to NY is BS. He had not expected it was going to be so high. He wanted to have more time to prepare his team to the attack.
    Now we have another game to play. Brodsky ‘somehow’ counts on $500.000. I think Drew is prepared for 2.500.000 and that the judge Schoenstedt will set the bail 2-5 times more than Brodsky wants because of the children, so it means 2-3 million. Forgive me my pessimism here. I want to be wrong!

  138. Brodsky, IMO, is just a figure and there are lots of smart and educated people behind him who just do not want to devastate their careers as Brodsky does

    * * * * * *

    Do you mean he will act by proxy for the Michigan Aboods, for example? Who would want to help him in this way?

  139. bucketoftea Says:
    May 18, 2009 at 6:30 am

    Brodsky, IMO, is just a figure and there are lots of smart and educated people behind him who just do not want to devastate their careers as Brodsky does

    * * * * * *

    Do you mean he will act by proxy for the Michigan Aboods, for example? Who would want to help him in this way?
    That’s exactly what I think, bucket, but I do not know who (unfortunately!). We all know there are a few people who helped him before who want to save their own skin now and I do not think they will play openly.
    It doesn’t have to be Aboods only… I can see in my crystal bowl much more advisors ;). Brodsky is just a monkey playing on the rope.

    IMO, today’s decision of the judge will be very telling.

  140. I somehow think, that Chrissy could be a key to keep Drew in prison if she decided to admit that all she did for him did not result from her love to but her fear and him molesting her. I hope this is what Allred could have on her mind telling she (=Allred) can be a witness in a very important case if Chrissy happened to confess something to her.
    Just my speculations and wishful thinking … 😉

  141. meirish Says:
    May 18, 2009 at 6:49 am

    Good Morning everyone, let’s pray this mother killer’s bond dosen’t get reduced.

    I took a day off, meirish, to use my whole energy today to communicate with the judge in this matter.LOL

  142. Thanks for the link, Grandam! It was hardly an “interview”, was it? lol
    BTW I had our equivalent to your little chickadee in my garden this morning, here chickadees are called tits. Really. Great tits, blue tits, coal tits, longtailed tits…

  143. Cyrhla, I think forced entry would be more like using crow bar or breaking a window. A locksmith can “pick” a lock without leaving outside marks, though the inside of the lock could show signs. Most criminal do not pick locks because it can be time consuming and they want in and out. The thing that raises my eyebrows is 1.) he didn’t storm in, as many reports had shown if he wanted in he went in, so what if she didn’t want him there. 2.) he didn’t call her family when he was returning the kids to see if they knew where she was and to confirm the return date of the kids. He said it was a “long weekend” and he thought maybe he was to return them Monday instead. 3.) At first I thought that her hair being wet many, many hours later was strange, like I thought maybe drew had actually been to the house and drained the water from the tub as it probably was bloody, but when I reread the timeline it says “soaked with blood.” Now that raises a new question in my mind if it was soaked with blood, why wasn’t that rinsed away in the drowning and if her head was soaked with blood why was there only 1 drop found near the drain? So did she hit the back of her and fall face forward into the tub that was already in the process of draining? If that is the case what is the object that she hit her head on and how did she manage to not knock anything else out of place. Was the drain stopper down?

  144. I saw Brodsky and Abood on FoxChicago this morning. They asked them why they are just now telling Drew to behave himself. Brodsky looked over at Abood and told him something to the effect that he should take that question. Abood said that they lawyers always tell their clients to take the fifth amendment and not to say anything and Joel has been doing a good job of telling Drew to do that but Drew is just Drew.

    Funny – Joel sits there beside him and throws fuel into the fire. I guess his memory is a bit out of sorts so I’ll refresh it:

    Joel Brodsky, Peterson’s attorney, called in to the show on Wednesday and pitched the dating game idea.

    “You know what you should do? You should have a win a date with Drew contest,” Brodsky said.


    I’d say it was just a thing of the moment while on radio except for Brodsky actually pushed even more media buttons by being publicly angry that they wouldn’t go through with this idea that further harmed his client’s image.

    Brodsky told a local TV reporter for NBC5 that the cancellation is hypocritical. “They make money by letting Steve Dahl do Drew Peterson comedy bits, songs and impersonations, but now they are too high and mighty and say they will not even let Drew on the air.”


  145. It’s all good, Cyrhla… I was just about to post “Don’t cry, that’s only Crapsky talking” lol

    Oh, Think! Brilliant quotes!….go girl!…and that’s why Joel won’t address those thing now. Do you remember he backed right off for a bit after it got personal with Lenny on Mike and Juliet?

  146. What a WONDERFUL day.

    I wonder…Will the two time murderer be cut loose on a lower bond only to be re-arrested for SP ?? Hmmm

    This could go so many ways ! 😉

  147. Reem’s body language in the GMA clip was interesting. She looked very tense and was gripping her one wrist with the other hand. Seemed very uncomfortable.


    Video coverage of this morning from Fox. The reporter on scene has an annoying take on things “…people lining up to catch a glimpse of Drew Peterson”.

    She should be reminded that some of those people are members of the victims’ families and that they are lining up because they want to get in that court room and see justice carried out.

    She made another remark about it “always being a media event” when it comes to Drew Peterson, as if he’s some kind of movie star.

    I feel like writing an email. It was really insensitive.

  149. Just heard prosecutors are asking for a new judge to take over the case. DP pleaded not guilty to both counts and they’re in a recess. Source was MSNBC

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